Attorney General Okays Using Drones to Kill Americans on American Soil Without Trial
You can stop pretending you don’t live under tyranny when the federal government claims authority to use unmanned drones to assassinate American citizens on American soil without due process of law:
“It is possible, I suppose, to imagine an extraordinary circumstance in which it would be necessary and appropriate under the Constitution and applicable laws of the United States for the President to authorize the military to use lethal force within the territory of the United States,” Holder replied in a letter [Monday to Rand] Paul’s question about whether Obama “has the power to authorize lethal force, such as a drone strike, against a U.S. citizen on U.S. soil, and without trial.”
To condense the verbiage, Holder’s answer was “Yes.” Senator Paul observes the obvious:
“The U.S. Attorney General’s refusal to rule out the possibility of drone strikes on American citizens and on American soil is more than frightening — it is an affront the Constitutional due process rights of all Americans.”
Collateral damage notwithstanding, drones have proved so effective at wreaking havoc abroad that the Regime is eagerly applying them domestically:
The U.S. Department of Homeland Security has customized its Predator drones, originally built for overseas military operations, to carry out at-home surveillance tasks that have civil libertarians worried: identifying civilians carrying guns and tracking their cell phones, government documents show.
The documents provide more details about the surveillance capabilities of the department’s unmanned Predator B drones, which are primarily used to patrol the United States’ northern and southern borders but have been pressed into service on behalf of a growing number of law enforcement agencies including the FBI, the Secret Service, the Texas Rangers, and local police.
Homeland Security’s specifications for its drones, built by San Diego-based General Atomics Aeronautical Systems, say they “shall be capable of identifying a standing human being at night as likely armed or not,” meaning carrying a shotgun or rifle. They also specify “signals interception” technology that can capture communications in the frequency ranges used by mobile phones, and “direction finding” technology that can identify the locations of mobile devices or two-way radios.
They could be using drones to neutralize troublesome Tea Partiers even now, for all we know.
House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif., believes that President Obama doesn’t necessarily have to announce that an American citizen suspected of terrorism has been killed in a drone strike.
“Maybe. It just depends,” Pelosi replied when The Huffington Post asked her if “the administration should acknowledge when it targets a U.S. citizen in a drone strike.”
ObamaCare is misnamed; it is was actually imposed on us by the infinitely more energetic Nancy Pelosi while Obama played golf during her last stint as Speaker of the House. The domestic use of drones will likely be expanded when the absence of a serious resistance party allows her to regain her Speaker post after the 2014 elections.
By then only a minority will care, given the trajectory of America’s ongoing fundamental transformation. Already 41% of Democrats and 43% of non-whites have no problem with the president using drones to execute Americans in their own country without bothersome judicial formalities.
On tips from G. Fox, Bill T, Henry, Bob Roberts, BoJangles, and Dr. 9. Hat tip: American Power.
…and STILL no one can see the evil that is Obama.
THEY MEAN US HARM!
I think “assassinate” is too strong of a term here. Read the memo… The wording is as a last resort measure.
With that said, I’m no Obama fan. I think the Democrats are involved in a concerted effort to tear this nation apart (my perception). Their perception is to probably to remold the nation into their image, fixing perceived injustice.
I think drones at a sporting event is a huge waste of resources and seems to infringe on the rights of privacy. Patrolling the border… Well I think it can be justified there since there is no right to privacy and smugglers ply their trade there 24/7.
Using a drone in a Waco-esque scenario to gather intel seems legit. Using that same drone to shoot at the nuts in the Waco compound would be murder as it goes against Habeus Corpus. However, same scenario, but now you’ve got the Koresh character with a gun to the head of one of his child brides telling the cops to back off or he’s going to kill the girl… Well I think this would be a legit shoot.
A legit shoot in a domestic law enforcement setting involves removing an immediate bodily threat to either the cop or an innocent bystander.
I’m no voice for the left. We’ve got to oust them and oust them quick. This memo however doesn’t threaten me if applied with the same standard I wrote above.
…AND now you know (as if you already didn’t) why weapons that could be used to defend yourself from drones or helicopters or DHS agents in armored vehicles need to be confiscated…and quick.
Fine, Mark. As long as I can have my Constitutional right intact to bear arms and defend myself.
DON’T GIVE AN INCH TO THESE GUYS! I think Mark is trying to be reasonable, but that’s what the progs count on. THEY ARE GOING TO USE DRONES, HELI’S, ARMORED VEHICLES AND ANY OTHER ASSETS to control the population if and when it gets out of line (i.e. disagrees with Obama Unchained).
DO NOT DOUBT THIS FOR ONE SMALL MINUTE!
…make that “Dobama Unchained”.
Don’t doubt for a single second this won’t be used on american citizens. Also, I can barely imagine the outcry if Bush had done the same. We,re talking wall to wall coverage on every news outlet for 6 months.
Jay, there is no need to imagine.
Bush held Jose Padilla as an enemy combatant without trial or access to council. Padilla is an American citizen. For that, Bush was ‘shredding the Constitution’, was called a war criminal, and lawmakers discussed impeachment.
Obama could slit the throats of children on national television and these same Liberals would support him.
By all means stock up on guns. The Second Amendment was designed for such an event when the government decides to go rogue. If the drones were ever used for assassination then shoot it down and battle against those responsible, however, I don’t see this happening in the context of the memo.
Counter-Moonbat Tex. Sen. Ted Cruz Reminds Gutless Wonders in The Senate How Patriotic American’s With A Set of Balls Used to Handle A Traitor and Commie – In An Exchange With Eric “The Slimy Weasel” Holder This Morning –
Cruz asked: “My question wasn’t about appropriateness or prosecutorial discretion, it was a simple legal question. Does the Constitution allow a U.S. citizen on U.S. soil who doesn’t pose an imminent threat to be killed by the U.S. government?”
Holder seemed frustrated by the question. “I do not believe… Given all the facts that you have given me, and this is a hypothetical, I would not think in that situation the use of drone– or lethal force, would be appropriate…[quack, quack, quack, quack]”
Cruz cut him off. “Attorney General, I have to tell you I find it remarkable that in that hypothetical, which is deliberately very simple, you are able to give a simple, one word, one syllable answer: ‘No.’ I think it is unequivocal that if the U.S. government were to use a drone to take the life of a U.S. citizen on U.S. soil, and that individual did not pose an imminent threat, that would be a deprivation of life without due process.”
They went back and forth, basically agreeing that lethal force would not be used in such a circumstance, but Cruz grew more outraged by the second at Holder’s persistent use of the word “appropriate.” Finally, Holder said, “Let me be clear: Translate my ‘appropriate’ to ‘no.’ I thought I was saying no, alright?”
“Well, I am glad,” Cruz replied. “After much gymnastics, I am very glad to hear that it is the opinion of the Department of Justice that it would be unconstitutional to kill a U.S. citizen on U.S. soil if that individual did not pose an imminent threat. That statement has not been easily forthcoming.”
He added that forthcoming legislation would “make clear” that at no point does the currently-in-effect Authorization for Use of Military Force of 2001 permit the killing of an American on U.S. soil without proof of an imminent threat.
http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/03/06/sen-ted-cruz-slams-ag-eric-holders-defense-of-drone-strikes-against-americans/
By the way, Sen. Cruz is quickly proving an hugely valuable and very articulate replacement for Texas’ former senator, the quasi-RINO Kay Hutchinson. This is proven by the mountains of hit pieces on him in the Slimes and other liberal rags.
http://blog.chron.com/txpotomac/2013/03/qa-with-ted-cruz-hysterical-ny-times-attacks-a-sign-were-doing-something-right/
“If your taking flak, you’re over your target.”
With another 50 Ted Cruz’s, we might be able to restore sanity to the Senate.
Mark – be careful. There are some genuinely insane people hereabouts who are honestly looking for an excuse to shoot at government people/property/etc.
Trying to talk sense to them, or mention things like ‘context’, are unlikely to be successful. I do however agree that in this case the obvious application is intelligence gathering – and potential offensive operations – against the likes of Waco, not the wannabe ‘tea party patriots’ around here who dream of shooting any random government official.
There is a great quote I can’t find this sec, but the gist of it is that Obama displayed a general garment, and these people immediately assume it is cut to their fit. Paranoid delusions.
Mark, under normal circumstances, I’d agree that the memo wasn’t a declaration of war against Americans. I’d still be WAY uncomfortable with it, and see it as potentially very dangerous, but not an immediate threat.
Under NORMAL circumstances (like having an actual American in the White House).
These are anything BUT normal times, and given that every single thing out of the mouth of Obama and the left is geared to destroy us or a lie, it gives me pause.
You seem like a reasonable person. Sadly, they count on decent people like you (and formerly, me), who hate to think that the U.S. government has gone rogue.
It has.
Interesting, the day of you bastards calling everyone that calls a spade a spade “paranoid” or “batshit crazy” or “extremist” is OVER.
Oh, you’ll get away with it in the media and on HuffPo and Daily Kos, but not here.
You are SO f’ing predictable. “Context”. Nuance. “They want to shoot everything that moves”.
No, we want to defend what’s left of our country. I will hand it to Obama, he’s consolidated power like no one else in recent history. But I will be damned by God if I’ll bow down to his evil power or white-wash calling him what he is.
You and all your cohorts must be SO utterly sick inside. You know what you are supporting, and it has to be eating you up. You’ll deny that with a laugh and some swagger of course, but down inside, you know it’s true. I feel sorry for you.
Barney Fife has authority to kill an American without a trial. Holder’s words pretty much frame the use of drones in this light.
If someone is holed up in a Federal Building and poses an active threat to the lives of others, then the local FBI can (and have) put a bullet through that perp’s head. If they use a drone instead of a bullet, what’s the difference?
I don’t think anyone is talking about Hellfire missiles… not because they’re illegal, but because they would create too much collateral damage. There’s nothing surgical about an AGM in an urban setting.
But, in broad strokes, our police have had this power – be they federal, state, or local – for over 100 years. Drones are new, but the use of deadly force against Americans isn’t.
Even without a trial.
Put your big boy pants on, would you?
The drone thing isn’t exactly a new concept.
Does anyone remember when the Philly cops dropped a bomb from a helicopter onto the MOVE Organization’s headquarters? It happened in 1985.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MOVE
Ah yes, the good old days….
Sky, don;t worry about the people like Interesting. He will be one of the first to run over to our side when he is the one targeted by the government.
And RobM, this is not about using deadly force to counter and imminent threat. This is about a politician deciding that an American Citizen needs to die and sending a drone out to do it. Perhaps it is you that needs to pull up your big boy pants and join our conversation, not the one in your head!
Holder IS A TERRORIST and so is OBAMA they both need to be tried for WAR CRIMES and TREASON
Skyfall –
Imagine with me a moment.
Imagine a world where Obama is not a Kenyan Muslim, but an American who went to Harvard, studied Constitutional law, and honestly believes that America can do better than the plutocracy and selfish narcissism of the Right.
Now… there is no imagining. Those statements are factual. So the fact that you had to imagine them (and all of the other esoterica that you imagine, from your own persecution to the veiled threat posed by Black Helicopters and the UN and George Soros and Ashley Judd) should really igve you pause.
The reason I am not ‘sick inside’ is because I am not a delusional Fox viewer who actually believes any of that crap. It simply isn’t true.
Interesting,
“…the plutocracy and selfish narcissism of the Right.”
Are you serious with this crap? Do you expect to be taken seriously posting dreck like that?
Dead serious. You don’t get it, of course, but then you have a vested interest in not getting it.
Stand up for billionaires at the expense of the middle class? Check. Demand total non-interference from government (except when it comes to legislating religious morality, of course)? Check. Demand cuts all social programs
but give more funding to the Pentagon? Check.
Which of these statements are you unclear about?
Oh, I see, more of the lie that the Right is all for the rich. While you and your ilk ignore the millionaires and BILLIONAIRES that fund and control the Left.
My apologies, Interesting. I thought I was debating an adult. Run along now, it is past your nap-nap time!
“[h]onestly believes that America can do better than the plutocracy and selfish narcissism of the Right.”
LEFT RIGHT LEFT RIGHT LEFT RIGHT ….
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_oNfVQ-7M-VQ/THFTY65XDgI/AAAAAAAAAP4/ohnlB1ZUoXo/s1600/march_of_tyranny.jpg
Stan –
Obama proposes the exact process of loophole-closing that His Mittness ran on. The GOP then says “no”. They would rather screw over school lunches for poor kids, or close national parks, or cut literally anything rather than close the loopholes exploited by the very richest Americans.
What part of that did I misinterpret? (The part where you are intellectually dishonest and completely unable to see reality?)
The wording is as a last resort measure.
Mark Johnson
This all depends on who decides it’s “the last resort”.
Lets put it this way;
Who gets to decide how much freedom to trade for security ?
Citizens, or the government ?
We could decide to arm cops with RPG’s or flamethrowers.
Chase a crook into a building….. burn it to the ground.
But we won’t tolerate that.
This is the purpose of the TSA. To see how many cavities citizens will tolerate probing for the luxury of being able to fly.
That being said, I don’t believe using privacy intruding technology on a highly technological society will end well…….for the government’s technology
Interesting, spare me the whines. And try to stay on one subject at a time.
The part you have misinterpreted is that you will support Obama no matter what he does and you will spew your bile and hate at the Right no matter what they do.
Run along and play now, INFANT!
This is unbelievable. This policy is no better than living in Iran.So let me get this straight.This president can kill at will.Any extremist.And Obama gets to decide who is an extremist.Christians maybe?Makes me sick.What has this country become?
remember when the media and democrats cried foul over the Patriot Act? Where are they now?
Again with the paranoid delusions… ‘extrimist Christians’ would have to be actively threatening American lives to be declared a target.
As long as you aren’t bombing abortion clinics or shooting atheists or whatever, you are not a target.
If however, you are actually a federal criminal, breaking the law in some way – planning violence, inciting violence, what have you – then this is literally no different than dispatching a bunch of agents to shoot you. They are just using technology. This is not new, in any way.
Scaaary! Coming to get you! Riiiight.
interesting, you seem to be operating under the delusion that EVERYONE has been hypnotized.
Well, Moonbatters, we must be causing some heat somewhere, or they wouldn’t be sending people like interesting here.
“If someone is holed up in a Federal Building and poses an active threat to the lives of others, then the local FBI can (and have) put a bullet through that perp’s head. If they use a drone instead of a bullet, what’s the difference?”
The difference is that it has been illegal to use the military to prosecute non-military combatants for 200 years.Now, that may have been violated by the Patriot Act,but that’s no reason to go even farther towards a tyrannical police state.What we should be doing is EXPANDING the rights of civilians when the technology the government can use to kill them without trial expands.Call it “paranoid” all you want, but if it is paranoid,no one is harmed by having MORE power over the government, only less,if the government plans to kill them.
“Dead serious. You don’t get it, of course, but then you have a vested interest in not getting it.
Stand up for billionaires at the expense of the middle class? Check. Demand total non-interference from government (except when it comes to legislating religious morality, of course)? Check. Demand cuts all social programs”
Go back to Venezuela,Che.
“Imagine a world where Obama is not a Kenyan Muslim, but an American who went to Harvard, studied Constitutional law, and honestly believes that America can do better than the plutocracy and selfish narcissism of the Right.”
The only way America can “do better” at its legal system is to apply the Constitution more. You can’t “do better” at a police state since you are not doing the same thing. It’s like saying that I can be more skilled at mechanical engineering by switching my trade to writing computer software.
All of the crap that you believe is based on specious arguments like this. If you take five minutes and dig through your litany of anti-capitalist class warfare talking points, you’ll see what I mean. Not one of them is based on a consideration of the totality of the facts,or a logical procession from point A to point B. What you people do is come up with a narrative “The rich are destroying the middle class”,ignore the evidence (the middle class are doing much better than the lower class,perhaps it could be said that the middle class is doing what you argue to the lower classes), and write in a colorful story that would take all of two seconds to debunk if YOU weren’t so invested in believing that rich white men are the devil.
Personally, I make poverty-class wages. I’m flat broke by the end of the week because I can’t afford to feed myself AND not freeze or burn up thanks to your buddy Obama’s irrational hatred of fossil fuels and the energy sector. I’m not invested in defending the rich, I’m invested in surviving. There are thousands of people like me out there. Hearing you rich (middle class is rich from our perspective) people spout this tripe makes me want to laugh. You wouldn’t know real hardship if it jumped up and bit you. I seriously doubt the middle class are living on one can of pork and beans a day because they can’t afford milk or meat, but that’s the situation I and many of the people I know are in. The last thing I want to do is prop up the rich at my own expense,you included. I don’t need Karl Marx or Che Guevara to tell me that,though,because I’m not an Ivy League poseur without an original thought in his own head like you are.
You may think that we are “useless eaters”,but we have a natural right to defend ourselves from people who are trying to kill us. And you, and your insane demands for more entitlements for middle class white people at our expense,are starving us to death and driving us out of our homes into the street.
Go ahead and complain about how “hard” the middle class supposedly has it. It’s your right, and unlike you, we don’t want to take anyone’s rights away because we think an example of “America doing better” is starving people to death so middle class people who already have jobs can collect food stamps.
By the way, interesting, once homosexual “marriage” is the (federal) law of the land, watch and see how fast Christian preachers become “extremists” and are declared a threat.
Being a Bible-believing Christian has already been demonized to the point where you cannot say “The Bible says this is wrong” without getting massive blow-back. It’s only a matter of time until the only “Christian” religion allowed is the ecumenical “progressive” sort that makes Jesus a community organizer and forbids all that “judgemental Bible stuff” from upsetting everyone.
Oh yes, friends…it’s coming very soon!
haha you really are paranoid and delusional. Who is the ‘they’ in your post? (Does it ever register that you are a crazy person in your own head?)
I am just a troll that enjoys wandering by and pointing out how insane you people are. Nothing more.
(But then again, that is exactly what I would say if I were a member of the Black Helicopter Cabal, composed of me, George Soros, North Korea, Ashley Judd, the Hapsburg Dynasty, and the Food and Drug Administration! We’re coming to GET YOU!)
HAHAHAHAHA looove this.
“interesting stuff says:March 6, 2013 at 12:44 pm”
“PARANOID”? OK, just WHAT THE HELL IS GOING ON? This has NEVER happened in the UNited States; not even when war was declaired on the south. Why all the guns and ammo bought up for TSA, IRS and EPA? Why are they asking for ASSAULT RIFLES? Why the armored cars?
Your head’s not in the sand, it’s UP YOUR ASS!
Forget it, KHarn. He’s just an innocent, harmless little troll looking for laughs.
He’s not here for any other reason. Not to dispirit us, not to try to discredit what we say, not to name-call for any other reason than his own amusement.
If we thought any different, why…we’d be paranoid! Delusional. Crazy.
Whew! I’m sure glad he set us straight!
PS Skyfall – I’ve gotta roll but one more for the road – there are things in your Magic Book that are in fact unacceptable in modern society. You pick and choose the things in your Magic Book that you enforce and ignore, more or less at random.
You will just have to be more circumspect in your preachin’ when it comes to the less-palatable aspects of your Book. You don’t see preachers extolling the virtues of slavery (although, of course, that is sanctioned by the Magic Book), you allow farmers to plant 2 crops side by side without stoning them to death, you allow NFL playeres to touch the skin of a dead pig and they are not ‘unclean’, and (drumroll please) you don’t preach on Timothy 2 11-12 and tell all women to shut up and do what they are told.
But you do love hating gay people.
See how that makes you a self-selecting dbag who should have to do a little soul-searching when you want to preach on that one particular topic?
(You probably don’t, but that doesn’t make me wrong…)
“I am just a troll that enjoys wandering by and pointing out how insane you people are. Nothing more.”
Insane from the perspective of a brain-damaged schizoid freak engaging in doublethink (Patriot Act BAD,using drones to kill American citizens without trial GOOD)? Sounds about right to me.
You people are so confused that being called insane by you is getting to be a marker for extreme rationality.
For your information, Interesting, we do so love it when intolerant atheistic JERKS like you come in here and tell is what the Bible does and does not say.
And I’m sure you take the same hard stance against Muslims and their holy book, don’t you, you pathetic little panty-waste!
As long as you aren’t bombing abortion clinics or shooting atheists or whatever, you are not a target.
Non interesting troll
What IS interesting is the fact that this all started with the government acquiring drones to go after enemy combatants on the battlefield.
And you libs went berserk.
Now that they wish to use drones as another way around due process rights, you are just fine.
“You don’t see preachers extolling the virtues of slavery (although, of course, that is sanctioned by the Magic Book), you allow farmers to plant 2 crops side by side without stoning them to death, you allow NFL playeres to touch the skin of a dead pig and they are not ‘unclean’”
That would be because he is presumably a Christian and not an Orthodox Jew. Besides that, you wouldn’t have a clue about what all he preaches on because you stick your fingers in your ears the second somebody mentions Jesus.
I’m an unbeliever myself, but I’m not religiously anti-religious, as you are. Even if I were, I’m pretty sure I wouldn’t need Bill Maher or Richard Dawkins to hold my hand while I came up with an argument against religion or religious people.
Nergal –
Watch this video. It is nonpartisan, just a generic infographic:
http://americablog.com/2013/03/shocking-video-about-income-inequality-in-america.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+Americablog+(AMERICAblog+News)
Tell me you are not incensed by that. You really think that asking those people to pay more (like, for example, exactly what I pay – this year it will be 36% give or take) is socialism, as opposed to exactly what we need to be doing?
If you can watch that and still support any GOPer who votes against raising those taxes and providing support for the poor, you get what you deserve. Eat some dog food and cry about it, but still vote for the GOP.
Also, for the love of… you do know that all of my post was from the Christian Magic Book, right? Deut 14:8. I’ll wait. Or Timothy 2 11/12, or Exodus 21… damnitall, you are not ever literate in the Magic Book of your own culture, let alone all the others.
Stupidity abounds. Why do I bother. (Oh right, because it is funny)
“interesting stuff says:March 6, 2013 at 2:07 pm”
And… it ignores the question. Fear, ignorance, “not part of the plan”? As I said before, I had been associated with communist “rebels” in my youth and I know their tactics. “NEVER defend your beliefs, always make OTHERS defend theirs”. “Mock the enemy, don’t let him have a chance to make his point”.
Idiots like “INTERESTING” always think they will be part of the ruling class. Most often, they are seen as a DANGER to the rulers and SHOT after the revolution.
“interesting stuff says:March 6, 2013 at 2:24 pm”
Non-partisan, MY ASS!
The beauty of the FREE MARKET SYSTEM is that the poor may become rich and the rich may lose their wealth. There are NO GUARENTEES, no “EQUALITY”, just OPPORTUNITY. That’s what FREE PEOPLE want: just a CHANCE. Under the many forms of socialism, EVERYTHING belongs to the government and some bureaucrat decides what you “need”. Under the free market (Which the United States abandoned years ago) YOU would decide what you “need”.
That’s right, America ABANDONDED the free market years ago in favor of GOVERNMENT control. We have been adopting SOCIALISM little by little and now we are FUCKED UP thanks to idiots like yourself. MORE socialism will not help, it will only make it worse.
1 if by land, 2 if by sea, and 3 if by drone
KHarn you didnt watch it, did you? You waited 10 secinds and turned it off. The richest 1% has more than the bottom 40%. I’ll say that again – 40%. It was W who gave away the farm, and it is on Obama to put it back together. The rich are doing as well as they have ever done. Ever. If trickle-down were true, those insanely rich people would be trickling diown so fast we would have zero economic issues. (Do we see that? We don’t?! It is almost like trickle-down doesn’t work at all!)
So – we go back to the Eisenhower era rates. Or even the Reagan rates. This does, in fact, work. If the insanely wealthy know they will get taxed at a very high rate for anything over (insert gigantic number) they are more likely to spread the wealth around – in the form of dividend payments, better employee benefits, higher wages… anything except giving that $ to the government. That should be the goal – to disincentivize obscene wealth at the expense of the rest of us. And all the sudden people like Nergal up there can stop eating dog food, get paid a living wage, have some healthcare the rest of us don’t have to pay for…
All of it perfectly logical, and none of it ‘socialism’. (I dare you to call Eisenhower a socialist the next time you see him. Honestly.)
The state-controlled media USED to point this stuff out… where’s GW Bush when you need him?
Interesting, I enjoy how you claim to be leaving, then jump right back in when you sacred cow was threatened.
Do you know why 1% have more than 40%? It is simple. It is because people that are rich do things that keep them rich, and people that are poor do things that keep them poor. If you were to take every penny of wealth in this nation and spread it equally among every man, woman, and child; in just a few short months, there would be people with much of the wealth, and there would be people that are broke and begging.
I know you think that it is SOOOOOOOOO unfair that people have more than you, just because you are a pathetic and lazy wretch who wants to be given everything. TOUGH. If you want Bill Gates money, then you go invent the newest and best operating system and put your name on a building. Now get back to work, those burgers are not going to flip themselves.
I thought ‘interesting’ had “to roll”. Funny how you manage to stick around.
Funny also, how I knew you were an aggressive, offensive atheist. I must be psychic! You meet all the criteria, right down to calling it “The Magic Book”.
I do feel sorry for you, but your kind of ignorance and prejudice is impossible to break through, so no point it trying to show you the truth.
By the way, we’re not “selective” in what we believe from “the Magic Book’. That would be your PROGRESSIVE “Christians” who do that.
What the Bible says, goes, and just because you misunderstand or choose to misrepresent isn’t our problem. In fact, you guys need new talking points. That stuff is so old and discredited, it’s embarrassing.
.
We got us another troll. Part of Dear Leader’s media strategy?
.
interesting stuff says:
March 6, 2013 at 2:07 pm PS Skyfall – I’ve gotta roll but one more for the road – there are things in your Magic Book that are in fact unacceptable in modern society.
… You will just have to be more circumspect in your preachin’ when it comes to the less-palatable aspects of your Book.
First, no self-respecting, God-fearing person would refer to the Holy Bible as the “Magic Book” so we all know with whose offspring you relate and who now owns your soul.
Second, there has never been a coherent and provable argument that any statement in the Bible is contradictory, incorrect, or fallible. I know lame ass people like you who think they are our betters have tried as they may with their endless crapola to discredit the Word, but they, like you, can do no more than fail.
Third, since by your remarks you reveal your ignorance of God’s Holy Word, I wouldn’t expect you to know the difference between God’s covenant with Israel and the Good News of the New Testament – Jesus is the fulfillment of the brokeness of the law and sin in the Old Testament. You too can find peace and salvation for your brokeness through seeking Him – something that you’ll never find in Obama or any politician, or anything or anyone of this world.
Fourth, The Bible does not attempt to hide the presence of slaves. Slavery in biblical times did not accompany a particular racial status, as it eventually did in the United States. Slaves were ubiquitous in the ancient world. The occupations and experiences of slaves varied greatly. Many performed manual labor in horrid conditions. Some highly valued slaves attained wealth and status, as in Genesis’ account of Joseph.
You have to be blind if you don’t see that slavery is going on today. What else do you call the top 10% of the people who work for a living being forced by the heavy hand of government into paying 70% of the taxes ($1.9 trillion in their personal wealth) every year to support the entitlement largess that 50% of the country have redistrubted to them annually. That’s certainly a form of slavery. We are slaves to the 50% of Americans that live to vote, live on the dole to vote for more politicians who are so devoid of morality and wicked that they would confiscate even more of other peoples’ wealth for themselves and to buy votes.
The question is not that we are all slaves, but who are you going to be a slave to: 1) Satan and sin, or a 2) Jesus Christ? That’s the question, “interesting stuff” What’s your answer?
“When you were slaves to sin, you were free from the control of righteousness. What benefit did you reap at that time from the things you are now ashamed of? Those things result in death! But now that you have been set free from sin and have become slaves of God, the benefit you reap leads to holiness, and the result is eternal life. For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.”
Romans 20-23.
‘Obama DHS’ Buys 2,717 Light-Armored Tanks…
You have more patience than I do Cling…but I sometimes forget that it’s not just a guy like ‘interesting’ who reads what we write, but many people.
Good job and well said.
Oh TED, there you go…thinking that Obama has anything but our best interests in mind.
Interesting
Where is the problem with the 1 percent holding this wealth ?
You do realize this wealth is invested, not stored in cream cans.
Just where does investment in job creating business come from ?
How can the poor create these jobs ?
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This does, in fact, work. If the insanely wealthy know they will get taxed at a very high rate for anything over (insert gigantic number) they are more likely to spread the wealth around – in the form of dividend payments, better employee benefits, higher wages… anything except giving that $ to the government.
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What really happens is these people stop working prior to reaching confiscatory tax rates.
Look to California revenues for proof.
http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2012/12/07/CALIFORNIA-STATE-BUDGET-GOES-OFF-THE-CLIFF
Only an insane leftist would suggest they would rather invest where there is risk with no return.
Uh…some ‘interesting stuff’ to seriously think about:
Obama Bluffing On Iran Attack?
Will Obama attack Iran to prevent it from bringing its nuclear weapons development program to fruition?
Barack Obama’s threats to use military force to prevent Iran securing a nuclear weapon are more than idle bluffs, vice-president Joe Biden told the biggest pro-Israeli lobbying group Aipac on Monday.
Does Obama mean it? I do not see anything short of a massive air attack from preventing Iran from developing working nukes.
Imagine Obama goes thru with the attack. Will some neocons switch parties? In the longer run as the Republican Party becomes less electable (demography is destiny) it wold make sense for neocons to move to the Donkey column so they can operate within the party that has long term power to try to maintain an aggressive military posture toward Israel’s enemies.
In the longer term I wonder whether AIPAC and allies can succeed in maintaining a strong enough US military to project force into the Middle East. Liberals aren’t so big on the US military. Liberals want more money to shift toward social programs. The demand for those programs will grow as the lower class continues to grow. Plus, the growing demographic groups have less of the religious beliefs (i.e. less fundamentalist Protestant Christianity of the form that feels special obligations from their interpretation of the Bible to help the Jews) that have allowed the domestic alliance in support of Israel to be so strong.
Will the very demographic trends that are strengthening the Democratic Party undermine US support for Israel? Is a Pyrrhic victory in the offing for some of those who support those demographic changes?
source:
http://www.parapundit.com/archives/008954.html
RAND PAUL and bipartisan coalition of senators (as the media says, its bipartisan if you have at least one member of the other party) support for filibuster of Brennan until questions get answered by the Obama Regime’s use of drones without due process against Americans.
“To allow one man to accuse you in secret — you never get notified you’ve been accused,” Paul said on the floor. “Your notification is the buzz of propellers on the drone as it flies overhead in the seconds before you’re killed. Is that what we really want from our government?”
Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/03/06/sen-paul-holds-floor-for-hours-in-filibuster-cia-nominee-over-drone-concerns/#ixzz2Mo1tJF2m
Dingy tried to rush things, lest he miss his afternoon nap time:
“Reid concluded that other senators should acknowledge that their work for the day is “through” and plan to come back Thursday.”
Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/03/06/sen-paul-holds-floor-for-hours-in-filibuster-cia-nominee-over-drone-concerns/#ixzz2Mo2Zpb00
“Eat some dog food and cry about it, but still vote for the GOP.”
Maybe I’ll take a leaf out of your book and vote for candidates who impoverish myself and my neighbors and then steal the money for my food through government-subsidized wealth redistribution payments from other designated groups that I disagree with ideologically, maybe your own. How does that sit with you,Engels?
“Also, for the love of… you do know that all of my post was from the Christian Magic Book, right? Deut 14:8. I’ll wait. Or Timothy 2 11/12, or Exodus 21… damnitall, you are not ever literate in the Magic Book of your own culture, let alone all the others.”
The Old Testament is the Jewish “magic book”, you moron. Exodus,for example, describes the flight of the JEWS from slavery in Egypt.I am more literate than you in the “magic books”, because I have family members with legal pastoral certification in Christianity, and for a time I practiced Theistic Satanism,in which a thorough knowledge of the Bible is necessary to subvert it and its proponents. After that, I practiced from real “magic books” such as the Lemegeton,Greater Key of Solomon,Grand Grimoire and the Grimoirum Verum,picking up along the way as necessary a general understanding of the phonetic structures of the Hebrew language,Orthodox Jewish,and heretical mystical Jewish texts. I can read the Hebrew Bible in its original tongue, as well as the later Latin translations, though I struggle with Greek.
I have also researched the rituals and tenets of Freemasonry,Hinduism,Jainism,Sikhism,Taoism,Confucianism,Shintoism,Ancient Roman and Hellenic spirituality,and proto-Germanic pagan religions,and currently researching the fundamentals of the Sumerian language in order to better understand the hierarchy and practices of their priest class through a reading of their sacred texts in the original cuneiform,including the Enuma Elish.
For you to sit there and tell ME that I am the one who does not understand religion is highly amusing to me.Although you seem to have come to the conclusion that all religion is bad all the time,it is not because you are endowed with a greater knowledge of the subject material than I. I suspect the same is true of your knowledge of economics. I don’t need to look at your link to know that republicans are not monolithically good and democrats monolithically evil,not even all Satanism is monolithically evil, some of it is just post-modern humanism in a sexy new package. The difference between you and I is that I have deliberately sought out the avowedly and undeniably evil to associate myself with. Unlike aging rockers I have not turned my back on that life and knowledge because I am unable to handle it,waving my hands furiously to warn others of the pitfalls of that ancient tree of knowledge. I am not here offering tales of caution and a plea to right yourself with a God I could not fully bring myself to support.
I bring back from the Stygian abyss merely a firsthand account of the things I have seen and done there.Like the mad prophet Ecclesiastes I have increased my wisdom, and with it my sorrows- at least in this matter-to bounds beyond the human imagination.
The reason, as I have said repeatedly in one way or another in the majority of my replies to you, that I have allied myself with your enemies is not a lack of knowledge of their faults,but a recognition of your own. Your arguments are trash. Your goals run directly counter to my own. Your school of thought WILL be replaced by a more reasonable one without so many holes in it,this is the way of history. Like a Union laborer organizing against the use of industrial machinery in the 19th and 20th centuries, your ideological fellow travelers seek to delay the inevitable. To justify your naked self-interest you must formulate faulty arguments and aggressively publicize what appears to the rational man to be lunacy or the most pitiable state of ignorance and stupidity. Because these faulty arguments are so intimately intertwined with your group’s existence,and have in fact become your raison d’etre,when the arguments are nullified, so will the class of people you belong to be nullified politically and disgraced. They will have a name for you, something along the lines of “Luddite”, and children will mock your backwards beliefs for hundreds of years to come, as you mock the views of Christians even now.
While I am no pontiff,there is a certain degree of “morality” inherent in nature, for what you do to me today, I may justifiably do to you tomorrow.
Remember that when YOU are the one starving,freezing, or dizzy from heat.Remember that when you are run out of your neighborhoods by us as we invade what used to belong to you and yours.Remember what you have said and done when the political underclass that you have betrayed and used for your own enrichment redistributes your wealth amongst ourselves and mocks the wisest proclamations of your secular saints, trodding you underfoot into the dust beneath our humble feet.
As Jesus once said,”The poor shall always be with you”. If he had added “And they will always remember how you’ve treated them”,he would have gotten the sentiment perfectly correct.You want class warfare? We are the class who has nothing to lose and increasingly more miserable lives (thanks to your secular morality taxes on the cigarettes and alcohol that keep us from snapping and murdering you) to trade for the prospect of a better life. Super-rich would be wonderful, but most of us would settle for YOUR wealth,property,and political power.
Like Pandora, your curiosity about what’s in the socialist box is about to unleash a torrent of suffering upon you that you literally cannot even imagine,let alone comprehend.
“And all the sudden people like Nergal up there can stop eating dog food, get paid a living wage, have some healthcare the rest of us don’t have to pay for…”
Oh, and I pay for my OWN health care,thanks. And if I can’t,I will simply die. It was good enough for my forefathers. My grandfather died of lung cancer in his own home without ever so much as going to a doctor for a checkup,and he lived to a ripe old age of 80,died peacefully in his sleep,and lived long enough to know many children and grandchildren. I don’t cost you one penny in health care money,you fascist lunatic.
When the president does it, that means that it is not illegal.
Countermoonbattery – Sen Cruz on Rand Paul’s Filibuster…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xL7FQ1lPm48
interesting stuff says:
March 6, 2013 at 2:52 pm
If the insanely wealthy know they will get taxed at a very high rate for anything over (insert gigantic number) they are more likely to spread the wealth around – in the form of dividend payments, better employee benefits, higher wages…
We do. When the government leaves us alone.
What do you think we do with revenues? Hide them in the freezer next to mother’s head?
….anything except giving that $ to the government.
That is so patently ignorant, it’s almost impossible to frame a pertinent comment.
How about this.. you are speaking like someone pontificating about Martians who has never seen a Martian but is absolutely sure they know everything there is to know about Martians.
That should be the goal – to disincentivize obscene wealth at the expense of the rest of us.
What is obscene about wealth; except not having it?
.
inserting stuff,
Gotta hand it to you.
You are definitely doing your part to validate
Gerald Crabtree’s recent thesis:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Our_Fragile_Intellect
That should be the goal – to disincentivize obscene wealth at the expense of the rest of us.
inserting stuff,
One more thing:
As long as there are people that think like yourself, wealth will always be made at your expense.
Obscene or otherwise.
.
Never mind the drones. Look who they invited into the Pentagon:
Chinese General Who Threatened to Nuke U.S. Leads Delegation to DC
http://www.thenewamerican.com/world-news/asia/item/14687-chinese-general-who-threatened-to-nuke-u-s-leads-delegation-to-dc
A top general with the Communist dictatorship ruling mainland China, who became infamous in 2005 for threatening to use nuclear weapons to destroy hundreds of U.S. cities, is arriving in Washington, D.C., this week as part of a “military exchange program” between the Obama administration and the mass-murdering Chinese regime. The explosive revelations, first exposed Monday by the Washington Free Beacon, sparked an instant public outcry, with critics slamming the visit as everything from a national security threat to a slap in the face to the American people.
.
“As long as there are people that think like yourself, wealth will always be made at your expense.”
And here is the crux of the issue. For whether it is “greedy capitalists” raping you on cheap foreign goods, or liberal activists forcing others to pony up money to ostensibly give to “the disadvantaged” but really sticking it in their own pockets and living insanely rich compared to most of the people I know, you are getting suckered. If you appoint so-called activists to steal money from you and everyone else, with the goal of supposedly spreading it around, you are a DOUBLE SUCKER because instead of getting raped once, you chose to get raped TWICE, you dear,sweet,lovable fool,you.
Whether you choose door number one or door number two, you always end up at the same place. Ruin.Door number two just gets you there faster, with more convoluted circuitous BS to go through,like taking an elevator to a basement,which always takes a certain amount of time, or in this case taking a long winding spiral staircase that you could theoretically descend at the speed of freefall,slowed only by the friction of your body as it is bashed against the steps,if you chose.
The only way you will NOT end up in ruin is if you choose to take what you want and risk being killed and having it taken from you. That is the choice liberals appear to be making. That is fine. Where the confusion arises is that they seem to believe it is possible to take from others with no consequences. You can no more do this than you can drink your fill from a well without carrying the water around with you in your belly. Perhaps because of their antipathy to the Bible,they are unable to process lessons from it which are actually secular. For the life of me,I cannot understand the attitude of these sniveling pussies.Even when I declared myself an anti-christ and Christ my enemy, I had no fear of cracking open a Bible and evaluating its message objectively,because I believed in the utter unassailableness of my own beliefs wholeheartedly.
“Those who live by the sword shall die by the sword, those who lead into captivity shall be lead into captivity”. This is not a silly proclamation of a fictional God, this is an observably true assessment of human nature. I find it beautiful,because it suggests that humanity’s faults are self-correcting and also suggests a glorious struggle worthy of honor for those who attempt to profit by evil. It is no badge of honor to me that you triumph in a system rigged against your opponent,but if you overcame the possibility of death to possess that which you have, it is indeed worthy of respect,even if you are otherwise detestable and worthless as a human being.
Anyway,I will stop posting my long screeds,because I am sure others are tired of them.I hope you will forgive me my indulgences,as humiliating the deliberately weak,stupid,and naive is still one of my favorite pastimes,old habits die hard,I guess. It’s just that I find more to criticize in the beliefs of those who think that I am the one in need of taking care of or chastisement (for my own good!hahahahahaha…) and the noisy triumphalism of the mediocre and smugly self-satisfied than in proponents of Christianity these days. After all, it’s far worse to be forced into a stultifying hell in this life than to be told that I will suffer in one in the next.
We can rest our case, fellow conservatives, that Nergal has presented above clear and convincing written proof that he and his kind are very much insane.
Cling,
Yes. Without a doubt this site has picked up along the way, some barking-mad psychotics.
Stop The Lap Dog Media Black Out On The NDAA Law Suit (Video)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=80IcJsUycmI
IN THE OLD DAYS…
Well, according to Holder’s answer in referencing Pearl Harbor, The American who were interred in camps during WWII for being suspects (I mean, after all they were Japanese!)would not have been interred but would be ‘droned’.
0bama puts the tranny in tyranny.
As long as they don’t waterboard anybody, ‘cuz that would be wrong. Odd that the same people who shouted about “spying on Americans” and “torture” now snark about “context”.
And these douchecanoes wonder WHY Americans are buying weapons like there’s no tomorrow? Are you kidding me? It’s coming soon people, I hope you’re all prepared….
Think about the movie INDEPENDENCE DAY think about the alien ships about to destroy the UN,SAN FRANCISCO,LOS ANGELES,NEW YORK CITY,MEXICO CITY,MECCA
[...] Attorney General Okays Using Drones to Kill Americans on American Soil Without Trial [...]
“We can rest our case, fellow conservatives, that Nergal has presented above clear and convincing written proof that he and his kind are very much insane.”
Fuck it. I’m done. Enjoy being disarmed and drone-striked.I’ll leave you to get steam-rollered and ethnically cleansed in your own country by a group of people who can’t figure out their penises are supposed to go in a woman’s vagina, not up another man’s bunghole.
“Yes. Without a doubt this site has picked up along the way, some barking-mad psychotics.”
Don’t flatter yourself. I won’t be back. I can take care of myself,but you can’t even defend something as ingeniously defined and outlined as the Constitution from a group of people who made no secret of their hatred for your way of life from the beginning. You bent over backwards for them and put them in positions to do the most harm to your freedoms,and then you call me psychotic.I don’t need your help protecting my liberties,but you all certainly need somebody’s help.
You’ve done a fantastic job so far,haven’t you?
Remember under another demacrat BILL CLINTON and his Chief Justice JANNET RENO and the BRANCH DIVIDIANS and thats BEFORE the DRONES