moonbattery logo

Jun 16 2016

Trump Apparently Flips on Gun Rights Already

This should surprise no one:

Like many other lifelong liberals, Trump has supported banning “assault weapons.” Now he evidently wants to ban gun ownership for anyone who for whatever Kafkaesque reason is placed by faceless bureaucrats on the terrorist watch list or no fly list. That would include one of the very few grownups to be involved in Fox News, Stephen Hayes. Getting on one of these government lists is likely to be much easier than getting off.

Banning those who are arbitrarily placed on government terrorist lists sounds sensible, but only until you invest a few seconds in thinking it through. If the government can arbitrarily deny us our constitutional rights without due process, we have a very big problem — the sort of problem the Founding Fathers would have expected us to go to war over.

Omar Mateen, despite being the subject of two FBI terrorist investigations, was not even on the terrorist watch list anyway.

As Daily Wire notes, this episode shows that

Trump will continue to drag the Republican Party and other conservative organizations to the left, and the media will help him do it.

He hasn’t even officially received the nomination, and already he is flipping on gun rights. Anyone who thinks he would follow through on his hard line immigration rhetoric as president would have to be pathologically gullible.

http://moonbattery.com/graphics/ted-cruz-goa

On tips from Torcer and Varla.



  • maudieNmandeville

    JUNE 15, 2016

    Fairfax, Va.— The executive director of the National Rifle Association’s Institute for Legislative Action, Chris W. Cox, released the following statement regarding terror watchlists:

    We are happy to meet with Donald Trump. The NRA’s position on this issue has not changed. The NRA believes that terrorists should not be allowed to purchase or possess firearms, period. Anyone on a terror watchlist who tries to buy a gun should be thoroughly investigated by the FBI and the sale delayed while the investigation is ongoing. If an investigation uncovers evidence of terrorist activity or involvement, the government should be allowed to immediately go to court, block the sale, and arrest the terrorist. At the same time, due process protections should be put in place that allow law-abiding Americans who are wrongly put on a watchlist to be removed. That has been the position of Sen. John Cornyn (R.-Tex.) and a majority of the U.S. Senate. Sadly, President Obama and his allies would prefer to play politics with this issue.

  • Pingback: Trump Apparently Flips on Gun Rights Already()

  • commentor

    Stephen Hayes is a grownup? Sure….

  • FrozenPatriot

    That settles it. I’m done with the NRA. It’s totally clear to me now that they do not want a literal reading of 2A — just like leftie proggies don’t. If our right to keep and bear arms was enjoyed as our founders intended, the NRA would lose it’s funding, power, and lobbying leverage. If they accomplished their alleged mission, they’d go out of business.

    Either these are rights, or they aren’t. Either they’re unalienable, or they’re not. Either we have rights until they’re removed by due process, or we have a tyranny of the bureaucrats’ whims. Either the NRA supports absolutes, or it doesn’t…

  • maudieNmandeville

    Like Obama’s IRS hit list of Tea Party groups, no one should concede one iota on any gun measure. We know how the Terrorist Watch List would be used, ie, global warming deniers, anti-sodomite agenda, etc. Drudge headline today:
    Homeland Security worried ‘right wing extremists’ pose same threat…

  • Hungjumper

    How about reading the Bill of Rights, Mr Trump? You DO know what that is, don’t you?

    And if you have your way, I’m guessing millions of “Tea Party” members will miraculously appear on no-fly and terror watch lists.

  • Eddie_Valiant

    Where are the trumpie trolls? Is the truth to hard for them to take? No smartarse remarks?

  • toheckwithyou

    OK you got me! I’ll vote for Hillary now.

  • Wilberforce

    I’m liking these guys lately way more than the NRA…

    https://www.nationalgunrights.org/

  • Wilberforce

    No! Vote for her donor instead.

  • toheckwithyou

    Or maybe I’ll just wait and see what comes out of the meeting?

  • Pingback: Trump Apparently Flips on Gun Rights Already | Tea Party News()

  • MAS

    Ask and thou shalt receive Eddie…be careful what you ask for. 😉

  • jack burns

    Just declare for Grandma Clot and get it over with. Say its because of your “principles”.

  • toheckwithyou

    Can’t we all agree that jihadist shouldn’t be able to buy AR-15’s? What is wrong with trying to figure out a CONSTITUTIONAL way to deny terrorist guns? Or is your Trump Derangement Syndrome so severe that you flat out reject anything he says without even thinking about it? I, personally, would not have a problem with nofly/nobuy IF due process is followed. Do you?

  • Kevin R.

    In the name of security they want to take away the right to due process so they can take away the right to bear arms. Here’s some more rights they can take away in the name of security.

    Terrorists can commit acts of terror because:

    They have freedom of movement.
    They have freedom of speech and can talk to like minded individuals.
    They have freedom of association.
    WE have freedom of association and assembly and so can gather in large groups.

    Once we start denying rights without due process, what will be the rights to be denied, and the next constitutional rights ti be denied without due process, and the next rights after that to be denied us in the name of expediency and security?

    The denial of due process in order to “control” guns will not end terrorism because that is not the problem and when that non-solution doesn’t work the left will want to deny other constitutional rights in the name of security.

  • TED
  • TED
  • GomeznSA

    But THAT is the problem, particularly with the no fly list – there is no due process. No on is allowed to tell you that you are on it, until you try to fly of course. No one is allowed to tell you WHY you are on it. There is essentially no way to get off of it. Yep sounds like full ‘due process’ to me.
    IF a person has been positively identified as a ‘jihadist’ there is probably more than sufficient probable cause to lock them up or at the very least to deport them.
    Won’t comment regarding TDS……………………….

  • TED
  • TED

    http://i.imgur.com/JWSfNlO.gif YOU don’t need guns, the police will protect you!!

  • TED

    !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! http://i.imgur.com/76Lz3Jh.png

  • TED

    http://i.imgur.com/MrndvL2.jpg SO do ANY STILL think there is a difference. REALLY, you POOR brain-dead assholes!

  • TED
  • TED
  • TED

    !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! http://i.imgur.com/QFRei3I.jpg

  • TED
  • TED
  • TED
  • toheckwithyou

    Well maybe if we have this discussion we can figure out a way to keep terrorist from obtaining guns while protecting due process. And at the same time maybe we can clean up this no fly list problem. If we are unwilling to even discuss it then we will have the status quo. We can’t behave like the left. For example any time we talk about trying to reduce the # of abortions they stick their fingers in their ears and start yelling about a war on women. Any time we even broach the subject of keeping guns away from suicidal maniacs we on the right behave the same way. Can’t we all agree that the goal is to keep guns out of the hands of the Omar Mateen’s of the world? If we can’t even agree on that then we are fucked

  • TED
  • toheckwithyou

    If the Trump / NRA meeting produces a plan that protects constitutional rights while denying guns to terrorist would you be on board with that?

  • MicahStone

    Haft-Wits nominated a Half-Wit…BUT THEY PROBABLY WON’T BOTHER TO ELECT HIM

  • MicahStone

    With all his physical problems, Trump will be as incapacitated a president as drug-brain-damaged retard OBOZO

  • toheckwithyou

    If Trump was really looking to undermine the 2nd amendment he would be meeting with Obama, not the NRA. It sound like they are meeting to get on the same page before he makes any policy proposals.

  • Kevin R.

    A terrorist is by definition someone that has committed an act punishable by law. Don’t play with words.

  • Pingback: Moonbattery » Fox News Attacks Gun Rights()

  • toheckwithyou

    Agreed. Let them all have guns

  • Troll Magnet

    in due time. my shiv needs sharpening after carving 762×51 a new one 😛

  • Troll Magnet

    at this point (you saw last nights temper tantrum by 762×51) i would resort to mockery. reason does not work with #NeverTrump’ers.

    [your favorite progressive troll, lolz]

  • Torcer

    Trump Makes the NRA Look like Idiots | RedState http://www.redstate.com/leon_h_wolf/2016/06/15/trump-makes-nra-look-like-idiots/

    Trump Makes the NRA Look like Idiots
    Is there anyone who has ever endorsed Donald Trump who wasn’t embarrassed by the decision less than two weeks later? The most recent honoree in the Trump endorsement embarrassment sweepstakes is the NRA, who woke up to this tweet this morning from Donald Trump:

    I will be meeting with the NRA, who has endorsed me, about not allowing people on the terrorist watch list, or the no fly list, to buy guns.
    — Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) June 15, 2016

    There are so many problems with this, I don’t know where to begin, so I’ll begin with the first reply:

    @realDonaldTrump Meeting with Congress might work, too? Er, you’re right. The NRA writes those laws.

    — Scott T. Smith (@UniPresser_UPI) June 15, 2016

    Memo to Trump: the conceptual problem with what you are proposing is that the executive branch makes sole determination of who is on those lists, with no due process, adjudication, or even opportunity for those who are put on the list to know about it or appeal the decision. Gun owners do not want President Obama or President Clinton – or President Trump – to have the unilateral right to decide they can’t purchase a gun through the simple expedient of putting them on this list.

    Of course, as a not-very-closeted authoritarian, I am sure the idea that he would get to be the final word of who gets to own guns in America and who does not appeals to Trump’s instincts. It should not, however, appeal to any actual supporters of the Second Amendment.
    http://www.redstate.com/leon_h_wolf/2016/06/15/trump-makes-nra-look-like-idiots/

  • Torcer

    Donald Trump Just Caved on Gun Control
    http://theresurgent.com/donald-trump-just-caved-on-gun-control/

    Donald Trump Just Caved on Gun Control

    Donald J. Trump@realDonaldTrump
    I will be meeting with the NRA, who has endorsed me, about not allowing people on the terrorist watch list, or the no fly list, to buy guns.
    9:50 AM – 15 Jun 2016

    Wow. Up until 2012, Trump supported the assault weapons ban. He only became “pro-second amendment” when he began thinking about running for President. This year he got the NRA endorsement and he just threw them under the bus.

    Banning people on the terror watch list and no fly list are terrible ideas because the second amendment is a fundamental right. The Republicans proposed a plan last year killed by Democrats that would trigger a probable cause hearing if someone was flagged, but never endorsed an outright prohibition on American citizens owning guns when it could be a government screw up.

    This is a terrible idea and a flat out cave by Donald Trump. You cannot deny constitutional rights to American citizens because the government is suspicious of you. The IRS has tried with tea party groups. The Department of Homeland Security has labeled returning veterans and conservatives as suspicious. If we did what Donald Trump wants, we could all find ourselves on a watch list to deny us our second amendment rights.
    http://theresurgent.com/donald-trump-just-caved-on-gun-control/

  • Torcer
  • Torcer

    Joe Manchin: “Due Process Is What’s Killing Us Right Now”
    http://patterico.com/2016/06/16/joe-manchin-due-process-is-whats-killing-us-right-now/

    Joe Manchin: “Due Process Is What’s Killing Us Right Now”
    This is really something. And yet it shouldn’t be surprising.
    https://youtu.be/kpJeAPLSmn8
    Ilya Shapiro responds:

    With all due respect, due process is the essential basis of America. The Constitution was established to “secure the blessings of liberty”—that’s the whole purpose of our government—and that government can’t deny us our life, liberty, or property without due process of law. If the government wants to deny someone’s liberty, it better have an awfully good reason and it better be ready to defend itself in court immediately—akin to what happens when someone is arrested or involuntarily committed. Otherwise, we’d live in a world where perhaps there’s less crime, but also life isn’t worth living.

    Senator Manchin may want to live in a police state, but few of us would want to join him there. Count me out of the time machine to East Germany.
    http://patterico.com/2016/06/16/joe-manchin-due-process-is-whats-killing-us-right-now/

  • Torcer

    Donald Trump joins Democrats in post-Orlando gun control push
    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/jun/15/donald-trump-joins-democrats-in-post-orlando-gun-c/

    Donald Trump joins Democrats in post-Orlando gun control push
    Brushing aside warnings that they’ll tip off terrorists to secret investigations, Democrats pressed ahead Wednesday with plans for new gun controls after the Orlando shooting, and even enlisted an unlikely potential ally — Donald Trump, who said he’s open to a discussion about banning firearm sales to those on the government’s no-fly list.
    [..]
    Democrats have revived their legislation to use terrorist watch lists to vet would-be gun buyers, implying Omar Mateen, the Orlando shooter, could have been kept from buying the firearms he used in his rampage.

    And Mr. Trump, Republicans’ likely presidential nominee, posted a Twitter message saying he would meet with the National Rifle Association to talk with them about the issue.

    “I’m going to be looking at it very, very seriously,” Mr. Trump said in an interview that aired Wednesday evening on Fox News Channel. “The terror watch list and the no-fly list — I’m going to be talking to the NRA about that and starting a real dialogue.”

    But Republicans, who have said the lists are riddled with errors, got backup Wednesday after they re-released comments from FBI Director James B. Comey, who told Congress last year that denying guns based on the secret lists could “blow” terrorism investigations.

    Mr. Comey, testifying to the Senate Appropriations Committee in 2015, said right now his agents are flagged if someone on a watchlist buys a gun.

    “It’s a little bit challenging for us because ‘known’ or ‘suspected’ means it hasn’t been adjudicated in every case that somebody is a terrorist,” Mr. Comey told Sen. Dianne Feinstein, California Democrat and the chief sponsor of the watch-list gun control proposal. “It’s somebody we’re investigating, so we don’t want to, obviously, blow our investigation. Sorry.”
    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/jun/15/donald-trump-joins-democrats-in-post-orlando-gun-c/

  • Pingback: Fox News Attacks Gun Rights()

  • MAS

    Yeah, just like we keep drug smugglers out of the country or weapons out of our jails eh? I’m sure that if we make magazine fed semi auto firearms illegal the boys from south America will stop off shore to leave their firearms somewhere safe because a ship full of cocaine isn’t a problem.

    Look a fact of life is that if there is a customer supporting lucrative transactions there will be a supply…no matter what the product is. I’d like to hear your plan to make what you are advocating happen in real life, not the internet or pie in the sky. Make if practical for the line officers that will be required to enforce it. Try to think of the logistical problems that say…France failed to deal with in their gun control “plan”.

  • Kevin R.

    How about freedom of movement? Do you think people that are on the terror watch list or no fly list should be able to have freedom of movement?

  • MAS

    There’s that Devil in the details thing…whoever defines “terrorist” can control just about anyone. Yeah that pretty much total gun control worked great in Paris, didn’t it?

  • Pingback: Fox News Attacks Gun Rights | Tea Party News()

  • MAS

    Incrementalism, look it up. The real problem is mouth breathers who refuse to live in the real world. Black market, look it up….we all know the Donald won’t (probably not the NRA either).

  • ramrodd

    If the government can revoke your right to access firearms simply because it has decided to place you on a secret, notoriously inaccurate list, it could presumably restrict your other rights in a similar manner. You could be forbidden from advocating for causes you believe in, or associating with like-minded activists; your right against intrusive, unreasonable searches could be suspended. And you would have no recourse: The government could simply declare that, as a name on a covert list, you are owed no due process at all.

    President Obama and Hillary Clinton are wrong to think that arbitrary lists are a valid and legal means of stripping Americans of their gun rights.

    It would be nice if the Republican Party had chosen as its standard-bearer someone who could articulate the conservative case for the Second Amendment and due process. Instead, it chose Trump. Now gun rights will be in jeopardy, no matter which of the two charlatans currently seeking the presidency prevails.

    http://reason.com/blog/2016/06/15/no-fly-list-no-guns-trump-agrees-with-ob

  • 762×51

    The NRA has been selling out American Gun owners for nearly 100 years.

    Once again, you don’t know what you are talking about.

  • 762×51

    They saw a stinking fascist fucktard called Troll Maggot stink up this site, again, with your mindless bullshit and deep sexual desire for your cult leader.

    Hey fucktard, question, when you train for your IDPA matches, do you find the incoming RPG fire distracting enough to affect your score? LOL.

    Here are the targets you shoot against.

  • 762×51

    Here are the targets I shoot against.

    Let’s have the MB readers decide which is a tougher course of fire.

  • 762×51

    Seems like that sword cuts both ways. Old Joe, and his Progressive co-conspirators intend to never give up power. That is the only way such a thing as eliminating due process couldn’t be used against them.

  • Torcer

    They think of that power as their birthright..

  • Sabrina Golden
  • Ed. G. Mann

    Cruz lost; he’s yesterday’s mackerel. What ever he had to, has to or wants to say about guns and gun control WON’T be said from the Oval Office.

    Because Trump decided to talk to the NRA about this bit with the No Fly list doesn’t make it a change. Would you rather have him talk to Obama abut it?

    The Moonbats here are crossing every bridge before they even get to them. One thing is certain; logical thought isn’t prevailing here.

  • 762×51

    The list of Constitutional Amendments the Progtards hate is longer than the list of those they would still support. The 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th, 6th, 7th, 8th, 9th and 10th Amendments would be gone instantly if they had their way. Of the original Bill of Rights, you MIGHT get Progressives to keep the 3rd Amendment, but only because they hate the military. The other 17 amendments would fall shortly there after.

    Enslavement is now likely because this has been allowed to continue, unopposed, for too long. I’m sure your children won’t mind living out their lives as slaves.

  • 762×51

    That was ‘your’ as in everyone, not you personally Torcer.

  • 762×51

    They cannot take away the 2nd Amendment right without also eliminating the 1st, 4th, 5th and 6th. Violence will skyrocket thereby justifying the implementation of a full police state, “for your protection”. That is their plan, count on it.

  • 762×51

    I already have such a plan and have tested it against terrorists. I call it, kill the bastards. It works great! Hajji shows up with his guns and I show up with mine. I smoke check him in mid “allahu ak . . .”. He goes to his 72 virgins, I move on to the next target.

    So far the recidivism rate is zero.

    I don’t need some snarky, fascist worm to make “deal” for my protection.

  • 762×51

    LOL, in your dreams, you fucking Maggot. Still hiding under your desk? I see you left out the part where you were too afraid to bring your IDPA pop gun and meet me in a real life gunfight. See, unlike you, I really have killed a man with a knife as well as a firearm and various explosive devices. You are just a keyboard cocksucker who shoots a cardboard and fantasizes about doing what I do in real life.

    Hey chicken shit, how many people came home from your last IDPA match in a box? HAHAHAHA, you wouldn’t last 5 minutes in my world, sniveling coward.

  • 762×51

    Maybe they saw the new unfavorable polls on their boy and hid like the cowards they truly are.

    http://www.politico.com/story/2016/06/donald-trump-unfavorable-polls-224454

  • 762×51

    It’s been a while since the NRA sold out gun owners, circa 1986, but they have been doing it for nearly 100 years. Check out Gun Owners of America, https://gunowners.org/.

    Exec. Dir. Larry Pratt is the real deal, not like old Neil Lnox who is only interested in growing membership to increase revenue. Notice Gun Owners of America is a .org, not a .com like the NRA.

  • Troll Magnet

    my god you project hard!
    let me guess, you’re an overweight cop wanna be but you can’t pass the physical, so the best you can do is guard a food court at your local shopping mall, while you fantasize about being a special ops ninja commando rambo chuck norris walking talking one man nuclear weapon of super awesome kungfu chopping destruction!

    hahahahahahaa, yea, keep bragging about your fucking knife kill you pathetic looser! cuz that’s what real warriors do, they go on the fucking internet and brag about their missions… NOT!!!

    you pathetic projecting loser!!! everyone can see right through your bullshit!

  • Torcer

    Donald Trump Just Caved on Gun Control

    Donald J. Trump@realDonaldTrump
    I will be meeting with the NRA, who has endorsed me, about not allowing people on the terrorist watch list, or the no fly list, to buy guns.
    9:50 AM – 15 Jun 2016

    Wow. Up until 2012, Trump supported the assault weapons ban. He only became “pro-second amendment” when he began thinking about running for President. This year he got the NRA endorsement and he just threw them under the bus.

    Banning people on the terror watch list and no fly list are terrible ideas because the second amendment is a fundamental right. The Republicans proposed a plan last year killed by Democrats that would trigger a probable cause hearing if someone was flagged, but never endorsed an outright prohibition on American citizens owning guns when it could be a government screw up.

    This is a terrible idea and a flat out cave by Donald Trump. You cannot deny constitutional rights to American citizens because the government is suspicious of you. The IRS has tried with tea party groups. The Department of Homeland Security has labeled returning veterans and conservatives as suspicious. If we did what Donald Trump wants, we could all find ourselves on a watch list to deny us our second amendment rights.
    http://theresurgent.com/donald-trump-just-caved-on-gun-control/

  • Torcer

    Yes, the Proggies see the founding documents as a restraint on THEIR power, thus their opposition to them.

  • 762×51

    I wouldn’t call what they do “thinking”.

  • 762×51

    Yep, and only children younger than five, fascists and psychopaths have an overarching need to control everything and everyone.

  • 762×51

    The article wasn’t about Cruz, you douche. He was merely cited as an example of what might have been a real candidate for saving America instead of the reality TV debacle of your fascist candidate. But then again, you are all about being a fascist first, aren’t you G Spot?

    Like tRump, the NRA is a sellout organization, has been for a hundred years. They will “make a deal” with the deal maker where he and they will win and America will lose. Otherwise there would be nothing for them to talk about.

    The whole “no fly list” thing is unconstitutional, jackass. There is no due process, you just magically appear on the list one day and your rights disappear. Some un-elected, un-named bureaucrat just puts you on a list. More likely, they will come up with a program that sifts data from the web and when a certain threshold is met, POOF, you are on the list. No “person” is responsible, no accuser to face. That is such fascist bullshit, it is no wonder you and tRump are in favor of it.

    See you on the battlefield, chicken shit.

    Your new tattoo, suits you perfectly.

  • Ed. G. Mann

    Cruz isn’t a real candidate, wasn’t, isn’t, won’t be. But you prove yourself right about one thing. You’re still a LOSER.

Alibi3col theme by Themocracy